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TIMESTAMPS
00:00 Intro Snip
00:50 Introduce Arthur Menard DeCalenge
01:40 Why did we change from Lambs to HAVN wear?
05:10 What EMF fields are we blocking with HAVN
09:00 What are some practical steps people can take to decrease exposure of harmful EMF without buying anything?
11:55 What is the rule “double the distance quarter the dose?
12:32 What was the egg in a microwave experiment?
18:22 What is Electromagnetic Hypersensitivity Syndrome (EHS)?
20:10 What is EMF’s impact on heart rate variability, resting heart rate, and brain waves?
21:33 What is the likely underlying mechanism of harm from EMF exposure?
21:48 What is oxidative stress?
23:20 What do we know about EMF’s effects on our sleep?
26:03 Why is our exposure to EMF increasing and what does the future look like?
28:09 What is in the HAVN fabric that protects us from EMF?
33:34 Is there a coupon code we can use on havnwear.com?
33:58 How comfortable is HAVNwear?
35:07 What kind of reviews does HAVNwear have?
35:45 How do we know that EMF blocking products actually work?
41:35 Are there competing EMF blocking brands and what is your patent on?
42:27 Dr. Haley tells of his experience purchasing a pendant to prove it didn’t work using an x-ray machine
43:56 Arthur shares an example of how an EMF meter helped someone realize the EMF they were exposing their baby to
45:40 Dr. Haley tells a story of being exposed to something that Arthur explained as “dirty electricity”
47:43 Which EMF Meter is best and why?
52:08 What are the benefits of all of this EMF exposure?
USE THE DISCOUNT COUPON CODE AT HAVNwear.com TO SAVE
TRANSCRIPT
heart rate variability, resting heart rate and brain waves.
all three of those physiological markers, we’re seeing the degradation in almost 100% of
subjects when exposed to EMF.
You are listening to the Dr. Haley Show, the podcast dedicated to helping you optimize your health. Each episode there will be an interview or a message to help you discover better health. We will be featuring health radicals on the show to bring new ideas to the table, as well as doubling down on key fundamentals to support you living your best life.
Your host is no other than the founder of Haley Nutrition Dr. Michael Haley.
This is the Dr. Haley Show podcast I’m Dr. Michael Haley, show host. Today’s
Guest is Arthur Menard de Calenge I hope I said that right. Or Calenge, You nailed it. Calenge is fine. Okay. And I’m familiar with you, but I never spoke to you and heard your name pronounced, But, the benefit today, we’re going to find a revolutionary way of blocking harmful frequencies from entering into your body.
And when I say revolutionary, you know, we’ve all seen different gadgets and things that block or supposedly block. I don’t even know, but this is very unique. Welcome to the show, Arthur. Tell us about. Well, first I’m going to say lambs. And also now the new name of the company is Havn. And why and when the change. That’s, we’re going back in time.
Well, first of all, Michael, thank you for having me. Super excited to be here.
And to hopefully shed a little bit of light on the EMF
for your audience. We used to be called lambs. We changed our name,
almost a year ago, actually. We did the transition in October of 2024.
And we wanted our name to be better representing what we’re creating for your body, which is a safe haven from EMF.
Getting
that, helping with that protection.
and Havn is written without an E, as you can see from my hat, because we’re blocking EMF. So, yeah, we made that transition almost a year ago, and for the most part, our community has been loving the new name.
and
what it represents.
And I can understand and respect it. I am the founder of my company. I understand you’re the founder of lambs. Now, Havn and I went through a little period of rebranding myself. It’s not easy because
we built a lot of goodwill on the lambs name. And
we operated under that name for many, many years.
So we’re definitely known as lambs and less so as Havn. But, I think in the long run, this change
will pay out, and it’s, it’s just better aligned with
what we’re about and what we’re trying to achieve. Yeah. And what stands out. What I remember is seeing a lambs beanie cap and I thought was really cool because I kind of like, you know,
beanies and, I wanted one because it was way better than my tinfoil hat.
Hopefully, hopefully slightly more comfortable, maybe less fashionable. Who knows? I am. Yeah. And I’m throwing it out being a little humorous because I think when it comes to EMF and stuff, a lot of people think about that. So what I want to do is I want to talk about EMF and really
not, well, some of it’s beneficial for us, right?
If we look at the electromagnetic spectrum, I went out in the sun, spent 20 minutes catching some rays to make some vitamin D, and we have, a PEMF mat at home that we can lay on, and we get red light therapy. So my understanding is there’s this electromagnetic spectrum, and not all of it is good.
Yep. Correct. So, tell me, what do you know about this? And how do we know what rays to block and how are we doing it? Yeah. So let’s, you talked about the electromagnetic spectrum. It’s a very, very, very wide spectrum that goes from, the pulsation, the magnetic field of the Earth all the way up to, you know, gamma rays and, and the nuclear radiation out there.
And, I mean, if I may jump in just because just below the gamma rays, we have the x rays. And I’m a chiropractor, and we know that we have to protect ourselves from the x rays. So we use lead in the walls so that we’re not catching scatter radiation and hopefully just delivering in the right area on the patient.
So we even put Lead on them in areas to block it so that they’re not getting exposed to the rays they don’t need. We’re just trying to capture only the ones we need to get that film, that image right. And so x rays are definitely on a much higher,
frequency than the EMF that we’re mostly going to talk about today, which are, electromagnetic fields that range usually from 400MHz to, 1014, 15,
gigahertz, which is the microwave spectrum.
The microwave spectrum sits before,
the visible light,
and, X-rays and even infrared
that we’re talking about, they first, started with microwaves, that heat up your food. It’s the same radiation, but they’re also being used by electronic devices to transmit information and to be connected with the internet, with cell phone towers, to be receiving calls.
to be receiving texts. And if you have a wearable device for that wearable device to communicate information with either your cell phone or with the internet, for your laptop to communicate with, your Wi-Fi router, for your car to communicate with, either your phone or the internet, etcetera, etcetera.
The concern around this radiation is that,
contrary to a lot of the electromagnetic spectrum that we’re talking about,
these are man made, radiation that are pulse, not continuous, and that do not exist in nature.
And the,
studies are showing that this type of radiation can have an adverse biological effect. For over 15 years now, they’ve been categorized as a class 2B human carcinogen by,
the world Health Organization. And there’s been over 2200 studies that have linked EMF radiation with increased risks of cancer, particularly, brain cancer, fertility issues, neurological disorders and cardiovascular issues.
And so we can dive, maybe after into the specifics as to why such a wide range
of effect. But in a nutshell,
we are in a position now where we have enough scientific evidence to know that this exposure is not good for us long term, and can have a wide array of effects, some of them being on the shorter term when we’re talking about fertility brain fog, fatigue, and some of them being on the longer run, not everyone’s going to experience the same effects.
But generally, just like with most environmental pollutants, if you’re thinking about pollution, plastic,
etc., we want to avoid as much exposure as possible to these pollutants in order to stay healthy. Yeah, there’s lots of kind of pollution. There’s, you know, noise pollution. There’s light pollution, which is why we can’t see the stars at night. And now electromagnetic frequencies that we’re being bombarded with from every direction.
And I know I love my technology right here. I’ve got my phone and
use this all day long and I’m surrounded by, well, I’ve got three monitors in front of me with all this blue light coming at me, and we got lights here lighting up my face and lights behind us, and there’s lights in the ceiling everywhere.
And all of these things are powered by electricity, which is just kind of running in circles with, you know, making these electromagnetic fields. And it is getting more and more every day. And I kind of feel like we need these things now. We can’t live without them. So they’ve been brought into our lives so much
obviously there’s ways of blocking this and we’re going to be talking about that.
But what are some practical steps that people can take to decrease the amount of exposure without buying anything? Yeah. The very first thing that I recommend people is when you’re getting home, or at a friend’s or a restaurant or in the office, wherever it is that you’re going, that you’re going to be spending some time, take your phone out of your pocket and put it as far away from you as possible.
If you are at a restaurant, you’re going to put it on the table. If you’re at home, ideally put it at least six feet away from your body. You’re going to drastically reduce your exposure from your cell phone doing this. We’re going to focus on home.
From now on. The other a big source of exposure that you’re getting at home is your Wi-Fi router.
So you can do a couple of things to reduce your exposure from it. Number one, make sure that you’re placing your Wi-Fi router in a spot where you’re not. that is not going to be near somewhere where you’re spending a lot of time. So don’t place it next to your bed. Don’t place it next to the couch if that’s where you’re hanging out.
Try and, put it in a place that is going to be as far away from the areas where you’re spending a lot of time, especially in the bedroom.
And at night, you can even most routers today can be programed to be turned off between certain hours. So you can shut off your Wi-Fi between the hours of, say, midnight and 5:00 am.
Adjust based on your own rhythm. Right. But the times where you’re going to be able to sleep for sure, and you’re not going to need that Wi-Fi again, you’re going to decrease your exposure for eight hours a day, just by doing this simple, simple thing. Last but not least, because we’re seeing a lot of people doing this still, do not sleep with your phone next to you.
And especially do not sleep with your phone under your pillowcase. Just because it’s going to be so close to your brain. Or if you do need your phone next to your bed, because either you’re addicted to scrolling Instagram in the morning or, which maybe you should quit, but, like, this is not what it’s about. Like, we all have our vices.
If you really want your phone next to your bed because you’re using this alarm clock or whatever, then put it on airplane mode at night. Airplane mode effectively blocks radiation. It stops your phone from emitting,
and you’re going to be much, much safer if you need your phone on because you have kids, because you’re worried about some sort of emergency somewhere, then please put it on loud and put it away from the bed.
Ideally in another room. And, yeah, between those few steps, you’re already going to drastically decrease your exposure on a daily basis without impacting your lifestyle too much. You know, I know these waves kind of go in all different directions. And I remember the saying double the distance, quarter the dose. Yep. And that was related to x rays.
That’s what we were taught about x rays in protecting ourselves from radiation when we were taking x rays, to patients meaning if we’re five feet away from the source and we go to ten feet away, we’re essentially getting only 25% of the exposure that we would have at the five feet. So double the distance, quarter the dose.
And well, if I can quadruple the distance and, you know, the further away we put it, the better by far the significantly.
I heard something about an egg and a microwave.
We did, we did some fun videos. What did you what was your experiment with the egg in the microwave?
The egg in the microwave was a video that we did all the way back when we launched the company. And the purpose was to represent what is,
the difference between wearing our underwear and not wearing underwear long term with the eggs representing, you know, your gonads and on, the microwaves, well, they’re emit the same radiation as your phone does, just, on the more intense basis.
And so we were putting,
eggs
in a normal piece of underwear in a microwave and then eggs with our Havn
boxer briefs that block EMF in a microwave. And we’re comparing the two,
with the eggs
exploding in normal underwear, whereas this stayed perfectly intact in our underwear. So that was kind of a demonstration of just, like, one the technology.
And two,
trying to visually represent because, like, with this type of hidden dangers, for the most part, it’s really hard for people to grasp the concept that we’re talking about it. They can’t see it. I think Covid has maybe changed this a little bit, and we’re more aware of what we don’t see
can harm us. But, for the most part, people tend to,
be more concerned about smoking when they see lungs of smokers versus nonsmokers, plastic, if they are aware of how much plastic is currently in their brain or in their body.
So
we’ve been trying to just visually help people get a better sense of, yes. The studies are here and it has an effect. And just look at what happens when you’re putting something in the microwave. It’s the same radiation that you’re carrying on your body day in, day out for 30, 40 years. And it does have an effect on your tissues.
That’s a good visual. And, you know, the cat’s fully out of the bag. We’re talking about clothing that can protect you from harmful radiation, of different frequencies. And in this case, excuse me, a demonstration showing eggs were not exploding when wrapped in underwear. Now, I know Havn wear makes more than underwear and hats and shirts and all kinds of different garments, but on this particular experiment, if we want to call it that, was it, like, significant?
How long when wrapped in the Havn ware did it last before the egg exploded versus wrapped in standard underwear? We never managed to get up to the point where the egg exploded
with our underwear.
So I could not tell you,
the other thing I would tell you is, generally don’t do this at home,
because it’s a really bad idea to put anything that has metal in a microwave and our underwear does have a high percentage of silver fibers.
So what I’m not saying is that as part of this experiment, we had a bunch of fire extinguishers right by. Interesting.
right by the microwaves. And,
we probably shouldn’t have done it the way we’ve done it. So again, just a heads up for people here. Don’t try that at home and don’t put metal in the microwave.
Really bad idea. We definitely. You know, I’m hoping my audience doesn’t have microwaves that I don’t,
that is even the better option. And if you do have one, make sure you stand six feet away from it. All microwaves leak today. And so
the amount of, EMF exposure that, is being emitted when you’re right in front of it is really high.
Yeah. My last well, my last home had a microwave, but it was unplugged, so we used it as a storage cabinet. And the home I’m in now has a microwave, but I know it doesn’t work. And if it did, it would have been unplugged anyway. And we use it as a storage. It’s built in above the stove. You know, if you got one of those, it make a good storage cabinet.
Unplug that sucker. There’s no reason to use a microwave. It changes things. And just like we don’t want our food change that we’re going to eat, we don’t want to be changed. So we need to be protecting ourselves from extra radiation. The kind that’s harmful for you. Everyone knows too. When I went and got sunshine today, I limited to about 15 minutes because even the good light can be overexposure and you’re still getting extra harmful rays as well.
From the sun. Every time we go outside, extra gamma rays and x rays and all kinds of things,
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I’ve wondered on this topic, I don’t know how it works because it seems that some people are more sensitive to others with exposure to even the sun. Some people burn faster.
Some people get wiped out when they spend time in the sun. Other people are immune to it, and they can stay out all day and they just get more energy the longer they stay in the sun. Do you find it’s the same when it comes to these electromagnetic frequencies? For instance? I happen to have an electric car.
My wife has one. I drive it sometimes. I know there’s people that couldn’t even go for a short ride in it, because they would feel the effects of the electromagnetic frequencies from the electric car. I don’t feel that. Yeah. The people you’re describing are called,
electro.
Magnetic hypersensitivity syndrome, EHS which is, now a recognized symptom in a few countries such as France, Australia, I believe there is in a state here who’s recognized that condition as well, where people can feel,
the exposure to EMF, and it can create debilitating symptoms such as pain, sharp headaches.
But a lot of people
are suffering from EHS or could be suffering from EHS without knowing about it.
Some of the studies, that have been done have been on short term effect of radiation. And I’ve shown that, EMF exposure can induce, more fatigue, brain fog,
headaches and,
migraines, without people necessarily knowing that this can be attributed to the exposure to EMF.
And some people won’t have any short term effect either.
However, we have done studies on us and as well as, external, scientists have done studies on the impact of EMF on, heart rate variability, resting heart rate and brain waves. We’ve done that via electroencephalogram. And we’re finding that with all three of those physiological markers, we’re seeing the degradation in almost 100%
of subjects when exposed to EMF.
So now, heart rate variability is a measurement of your body’s ability to sustain stress. You’re not necessarily going to know if your heart rate variability is higher or lower. Higher equals better in general. But it is a good,
indicator of how much stress your body’s under. If you have a Oura Ring or if you have a whoop or if you have an Apple Watch, that is one of the, markers that they’re using
to know how much, readiness or energy or how well you’re feeling on any given day.
So your body is reacting to EMF. Some people are going to feel that reaction more than others. And also some people are going to have different symptoms. And I think part of the explanation lies in the fact that, well, we all are different, and the underlying mechanism of harm that is most widely accepted for EMF
Studies are
still ongoing. Is an increase in free radicals and oxidative stress that is associated with EMF, and oxidative stress is one of the root causes of a lot of today’s modern diseases. And also can be created by chronic conditions
And that is one of the underlining causes of the symptoms that you’re facing when, you have a chronic condition.
And so, similarly, some people who suffer from certain chronic conditions can have those symptoms exacerbated when exposed EMF just like their symptoms, can be exacerbated when they are suffering from poor sleep, when they’re not, eating properly, when they’re not exercising. All of these are contributors to oxidative stress. And so again, depending on your lifestyle, depending on your underlying health, depending on your genetics, you may or may not feel the effects of EMF, but that doesn’t mean that there is no long term health effects that can be accumulating in your case.
Michael, when you’re
in this car, or you’ll be fine, just like some people smoke daily and live to 90 with no lung cancer. Whereas,
secondhand smoking
can lead
to a deadly cancer. So, everyone’s different when it comes to sensitivity of different things. Yeah. And what if it is interfering with sleep and we don’t even realize.
But that’s the night we don’t sleep well because we spent more time in the electric car. Who knows? And what if we’re being bombarded and every day and we’re not sleeping well or on the system? Yeah. On sleep, it’s very interesting. There has been some studies done on the link between EMF and sleep quality, and it’s looking like EMF does affect sleep quality.
And this is something that we’ve been able to test, field test with some of our customers when we launched the Havn Pajamas, we had a cohort of people who had been sleeping with and Oura Ring or, any kind of tracker that started wearing the Havn pajamas. They had a stable lifestyle outside of that one change, and we, monitored receive quality over several weeks for the before, after.
And then we asked the people who, were participating in that crowdsource study, which is not, does not have the rigor of a scientific study, peer review. Like, I want to say this out there, this was a field test with our customers, but we asked our customers to remove the pajamas, and we’ve measured sleep quality over, with, without, with, without, with and, we’ve been able to see that in about three quarters of people, a pretty significant, change in sleep quality
when wearing the pajamas, which again, the only thing those pajamas are doing are blocking, EMF from reaching their body.
And are you saying that the difference was that the sleep quality was better with the pajamas? Right. Okay. Yeah.
which goes in line with what the studies on EMF and sleep quality, were identifying which is that EMF getting bad to sleep quality, which again,
if we go back to the underlying root cause, a state of oxidative stress means that
our cells and tissues are currently being damaged, which generally means that our body’s in a, sympathetic state instead of parasympathetic state, which can affect, ultimately, sleep quality.
This might be a little too nerdy, and I don’t really understand if it works this way or not. I don’t understand telomeres, but what I do know is my particular body seems to overcome things very quickly. So I can say, well, I’m not being affected by this. This doesn’t change anything about me. But for all I know, I’m just, shortening my telomeres a lot faster.
Who knows? Maybe that candle is going to burn out faster than it’s supposed to. I don’t know, the reality is, like when it comes to the long term effect, what we do know is that the biological effects that, EMF can trigger, such as DNA damage in particular, are, in the long run associated with long term health, problems and mostly cancer.
Now,
the amount of exposure that we have has been increasing exponentially over the last few years. So we don’t even have the data of what happens with the level of exposure that we have today in 30 years, in 40 years, what we do know is that it has an effect in our biology. Now, hopefully in 30 years, 40 years,
it’s just a small difference.
But it could be a big one. And where the world is headed, it’s towards more and more exposure because technology’s evolving, which for the most part is amazing. You know, and if you take self-driving cars, for instance, it’s going to be an incredible, an incredible change, which is, just going to be massive. But they rely on, EMF and technology in order to continue operating and operating better.
And so we’re just headed towards more exposure without knowing what the effect of this cumulative exposure is over the long run. And we won’t have the full picture, before 30 years from now. And that’s why
we created a Havn in the first place, which was what we love the technology and we don’t want to stop. And we’re not doomsayers, by any means.
We, just want to continue living a healthy, happy life as long as possible and continue using technology without suffering from the downside. I’m chuckling a little bit because my daughter just started driving, and my first thought is, I want her in a car where she has to make very few decisions. Wouldn’t that be great if she just sat in it and said, this is where I want to go, and I know it’s going to get her there without getting in an accident.
And I know the cars around her are doing the same thing. So they’re going to, you know, it scares the heck out of me seeing the kids drive off in cars for the first time. Yeah, I get that. We have this technology, so there is a trade off. Absolutely right. And I’m understanding, though, I could be in that car with a little bit of protection just based on the clothing that I’m wearing.
Right. What’s the secret sauce and, clothing in the material.
what’s in the fabric? Yeah. So, I’ll go back to the origin story, a little bit. I’m an engineer and scientist by trade. Very first job was studying the genetic patterns of prostate cancer. When I started learning about the study behind EMF Dove in and, figured out, well, we’re going towards a world of more exposure, not less.
But technology is amazing. And so how do we reconcile the two of them? How do we get protected from, EMF while still being able to use all devices? And, we just use the car analogy. So let’s go into it like when cars were created. Amazing. We can cover much longer distances faster than if we’re on a horse.
Flip side to it, if you crash into a wall, you’re going way faster into that wall and you’re much more likely to die. So what did we do? We created seatbelts. This was kind of like the. Well, what’s the seatbelt for? Today’s, EMF exposure,
the reason why our devices are emitting radiation are to communicate with one another.
So we cannot shield the device itself. We can’t stop it from emitting radiation, and we can’t, block the radiations that are currently circulating without interfering with our devices working properly. So the only thing we can do if we want to be protected is shielding.
is preventing Emfs from reaching our body. Which means that we need to create a electromagnetic shield, essentially a barrier, between our body and our devices.
The,
only application that existed with regards to this, actually, two applications you mentioned lead, lead vests before, and spacesuits, spacesuits have a built in layer of electromagnetic shielding for when astronauts go into space because they’re exposed to a ton of radiation during space travel. And, spacesuits are not super comfortable. Lead vests are not very comfortable either.
So we set out to create a fabric that would retain the same physical properties, but that could be used in regular clothing. That could look nice, feel nice, be comfortable, be washable, and act just like a normal clothing. And that’s what we’ve done with wave stopper. So wave stopper is a fabric that is made with a proprietary, grid of pure silver fibers.
And the way this silver fiber grid is woven creates an electromagnetic shield, meaning that it reflects and absorb, 99.7% of the EMF radiation from 400MHz. 40GHz, when it’s reaching the body before it reaches your organs. And then we turn that wave stopper fabric into the world’s first EMF blocking clothing. We started with underwear. We mentioned that, that was the, the egg experiment.
Got to protect the eggs. Got to protect the eggs. And then the noggin, moved into, hats and then t shirts and Thyroid-Gaiters And we’ve since then expanding our product line up. We mentioned, pajamas. We have now, blankets for home. We have a number of products, that have been built, to reduce
Your essential organs, exposure to EMF radiation. That’s been kind of how we’ve been thinking about product line up, as always, been. Well, what are, most essential organ that we need to protect? And what are the form factors, that are the most, convenient with regards to creating that, that protection layer. And so for people who are watching us on stream right now, to give you an idea, I’m currently wearing a wave stopper t shirt as well as a wave stopper hat.
And as you can see, the material is, behaving just like you would with a traditional T shirt. And yeah, I’m wearing a traditional t shirt and looking at a side by side, it looks like we’re both wearing traditional t shirts. Not a big difference. Yeah, yeah, well, I’m making products in my head right now.
I’m thinking. Well, I don’t know if I’d ever wear pajamas, but I’d probably put an ice sheet over me. That would be nice. And we have a blanket. Yeah. And wouldn’t it be cool? What about a car seat cover? And there’s some. There’s so many things you can do with this. We’re very much in the idea beginning of, the journey, and we’re somewhere between 2 and 3% of a fully scaled product line on our end right now.
And so we’re working on a lot of, different iterations. We’re still a small company, so, you know,
we’re going at a pace which is sustainable. But, but there is there are a lot of products that are going to come out in the next few years and, and hopefully help people getting more and more protection without, changing anything with regards to lifestyle.
You know, for anyone that’s listening in, and you’re not going to make it to the end of this podcast, I was told that, by one of your helpers that they could use the coupon code. SEE IMAGE on Havnwear.com. So I want to throw that out there right now. If anyone’s checking it out, thinking I want this.
Well, it makes sense. Why wouldn’t you? Who doesn’t? How comfortable is it? Well, you’re asking someone is fully biased, but I would. I’ll say this, when we created the company, we got extremely lucky.
And we got connected to the former president of Lululemon, Brett Conrad, who’s been one of our early investor and advisor. And,
with his help, our North Star has been to make sure that when you’re opening your drawer to pick your underwear or to be a T-shirt, you’re gravitating towards a Havn T-shirt, not just because it blocks EMF but also because it’s your best looking, most comfortable.
Essential. When it comes to clothing. And so we went through over 100 iteration of the fabric. We went through a number of iteration on the fit as well.
And we keep on,
making progress. Always like we’re in a constant improvement
process, to make sure that, we are really providing you with the most high quality, piece of clothing
that we can provide you with.
So our reviews are phenomenal. We’ve crossed 5k, 5 star reviews. And, so I would say that for the most part, people are really happy with how it fits and the quality. And now everyone’s morphology is different and we can’t satisfy everyone. And, for some people it won’t fit as well as for others. But, this really has been a key piece of making Havn successful, which is that we realized that if we create a solution that people don’t want to wear, that solution is not going to be super effective.
So
that’s really been the North Star for us. Yeah, that makes sense. There’s a lot of companies out there, that have their different things that block or supposedly block harmful radiation or frequencies. How many of them work? How many of them don’t? And how do we know what to avoid? What’s a scam and what’s real?
How do we test that? Yeah, I love that we’re getting onto that topic. Because when we started with Havn there were a lot of scammy companies out there, that were supposedly claiming to block or harmonize or purify or I don’t know what kind of words they were using. EMF and, these scams have been going on since the year 2000.
The FCC goes and shuts down companies and then, for every one, they shut down like ten more pop ups because it’s an unregulated space. And, while there are, standards with regards to testing products, where, you know, we’re tested and certified by independent laboratories according to international standards, there is no regulation that says that you need to be tested in order to claim that you’re blocking the EMF, or that you’re harmonizing EMF or purifying them or what have you.
So unfortunately, there are a lot of scammy products out there,
starting with stickers,
pendants,
any,
kind of devices that you’re going to, glue or put on your body or on your phone or on your desk, that is going to create a protection space, a purifying space, a harmonizing space. All of this, has no scientific basis.
There is no such thing as harmonizing radiation. There is no such thing as purifying radiation.
so the best way to. I’m. I’m going to help the audience here with two tips. With regards to how to know if something works or not. The first one is,
if it’s something that is at the device level, if your device keeps working, meaning if your cell phone keeps getting texts, it keeps getting, calls internet when you have that sticker onto it, it’s not working.
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Hang on a second. Let’s jump on some. This is a tough one. I’m uncomfortable putting it out there, but I’m gonna. If I wrap your phone in your clothing, is it still going to ring if I call it? Most likely not.
And the reason I’m saying most likely is for two reasons.
One with like 99.7% of EMF. So there are still a little bit that goes through, two cell phones are designed in a way that
if they don’t have a cell phone connection, they can emit up to ten times more in order to get cell phone connection. That’s why if you go to the desert and you don’t have cell phone coverage, you can, you can experiment with this.
Your battery is going to drain much faster. And the reason behind this is because your cell phone is emitting so much more in order to get that cell phone signal. So if you’re putting, a cell phone into our clothing, in most instances, it’s going to block, calls. It’s for, sure. Going to, block most of your internet signal.
But your cell phone is going to emit so much harder in order to find that signal that it might actually through, even through 0.3% of the radiation, be able to get a little bit of that signal, again, emitting ten times more. Now, an easier test might be if you were connected to a Bluetooth speaker. Yeah. And then, yeah, absolutely.
But the best test is actually the one that was about to suggest, which is, buying a high quality EMF meter. We actually sourced the best one we could find, and we people can find it on our website. Or you can go on Amazon. Just make sure you’re buying a high quality one. Don’t buy one of the 20, 30, 40.
Anything under 150 to $200 is likely not going to be high quality. We tested all of them. So because we are really trying to find the cheapest one
that we can offer people, and with an EMF meter, you’re actually able to test and see the difference in terms of, well, first you’re able to test your home, which is awesome because your, specifically for your bedroom or other areas that helps with regards to identifying devices or hotspots where you have more exposure
than not.
And then, through this, you can also test any device that claims to be blocking the EMF. And in our case, if you want to test the products using an EMF meter, which is not the most accurate way, but you can put the EMF meter inside of the clothing and keep the cell phone, for instance, outside of it, which is the intended use way, because, again, if you’re putting a cell phone inside of the products, it’s behaving in a different way.
So a little bit of a difference between keeping radiation inside, like a microwave or keeping them from getting inside. Think of a prison. Generally it’s designed to keep inmates inside the prison, not necessarily from keeping people to come inside the prison, if that makes any sense. So it does. It does. What’s the competition like?
Is there competition out there in this? I know that you have some kind of patent
on your product. We do. Yeah. So we filed IP, on
the fabric and the products. And so we’re really well protected on that front. Most the biggest competition we have out there are the stickers of the world, that unfortunately don’t do anything.
But the reality is, and I’m using this as competition,
they don’t work. And ultimately, they will be shut down.
But we’re still in a new field where,
there is not enough,
legislation and regulation just yet, but, but that will likely evolve. And the unfortunate reality is that if a sticker could do the job, that would be much more convenient than changing your clothing
but it’s too good to be true.
Generally. It’s not true. Yeah,
and I purchased one really Just to prove that it didn’t work well years ago. It wasn’t a sticker. It was more of like, some kind of metallic thing. Yeah. I mean, they come in all forms and factors in the sales pitch said that it would, like divert the radiation, including x rays and gamma rays and all of those high end rays.
So I thought, well, this is an easy test. So let me just stick it up on the Bucky there and push the x ray button and take a picture of it. Because if it’s pushing the rays away,
the film should not get exposed. And even if it’s just pushing it away a little bit, I should see a shadow.
I should see at least a lessening of exposure around the edges of it. If it’s pushing it away at all. And it was an absolute clear cut line, you know, this thing was blocking x rays from going through it as any metal will right? But it was not at all diverting them. I do like your idea of having some kind of handheld unit where you can actually point it and be aware, you know, what’s happening when I get in my car, my electric car.
Well, what’s happening when I, with this mesh network in my home and or in my office, in my work environment, it’s been, it’s been a really a game changer for friends and family,
especially, because it’s again, it’s something that is invisible. it’s hard to know what emits, what doesn’t emit, you know, and, my brother just had a second kid, and they bought a webcam for the kid or whatever it is, like one of those cameras that is right above the bed.
And then he got one of our EMF meters and tested
where the baby sleeps. And, it’s emits a ton of radiation because it’s transmitting audio and video, and, right where the baby’s spending a lot of time, especially a newborn sleeping most of the day. And, and we’re, it’s still have a developing brain and, developing immune system.
And so, needless to say, stopped using the webcam, immediately after. And so there are a lot of, just devices and areas in our home that we don’t realize can emit radiation. So that device is super helpful with regards to helping shed light on this
and help people. See also, see the invisible denture that we’re talking about.
Yeah, I’m a fan of hard wiring. Cat5 cable Cat6 cable. It’s, it’s. Yeah, it’s hard for the average home. And then depending on where you live, in this office.
Right here, I believe I’ve got about 34 Wi-Fi signal that I’m able to get, so even, you know, if we hard wired the office, we’d still be exposed to all the other offices around.
And same in most homes and apartment, especially apartment buildings, where you have your upstairs neighbor, downstairs neighbor on the sides, etc..
as much as possible again, double the distance, 25% of the exposure. So it’s, but cumulatively that exposure
can add up for sure. Yeah. I don’t know if I was being exposed to electromagnetic radiation through this, but going back probably when I was about 20 years old in college and, you know, living like a bachelor, I remember having I just put the mattress on the floor and that’s what I slept on.
It wasn’t even a proper bed or anything. And I started getting headaches, and I couldn’t figure out why I was getting headaches. What’s wrong with me? Am I getting brain cancer? What’s going on? Eventually I realized that, well, I slept on the floor with my head near the wall and right, you know, a few inches above my head was an electric outlet with everything plugged into it, like my alarm clock and lamps and things like that.
I considered the possibility that just the moving electricity in the walls were causing it, so I unplugged everything. No more headaches. I’m guessing that’s the same kind of energy possibly coming from just the moving of electricity near my head that was doing something there. That was a long time ago. I’m glad I figured it out. I’m glad I unplug things.
I don’t know what was happening, or if I’d even be here today if I didn’t make a change.
It makes sense. What you’re describing, is also called the dirty electricity.
And less studied. But, that there are, probably about one tenths of the amount of studies on
what’s called
extremely low electromagnetic radiation compared to, traditional microwaves.
But there has been studies
on their effect as well. And it seems to indicate that they also have a biological effect. Now,
some,
areas have much more, dirty electricity than other as well. I’m not as well-versed on the topic as I am. Okay. The microwave subject. So I’m not going to be able to comment, in, with enough accuracy that,
Yeah, yeah. So if we wanted to buy a tester, what do you recommend? And where do we get it from? An EMF meter? Which one? Yeah. What’s your, I mean,
the one we offer on our website. You have one on your website?
Yeah, we spent a lot of time, testing and sourcing all the different EMF meters, to find
the easiest to use, because you have some real complicated ones out there. For the average consumer,
and the one that would be the most accurate as well. As I mentioned, you can find a lot of cheap ones on Amazon.
Unfortunately, they don’t work really well, and it’s easy to test, actually, if you put it next to a phone or like,
areas that clearly emit radiation, you’ll find that oftentimes it’s picking up electricity more so
than,
electromagnetic radiation. So we, we tested all of them, and we found essentially the cheapest one that was easy to use.
and then we source it in bulk and we sell it
on the website. So
that’s probably the best bet with regards to finding a high quality one for cheap. You know, for someone on a limited budget. That couldn’t afford a wardrobe change, I’m thinking that would probably be the best first purchase.
Absolutely. It’s going to help you identify areas and devices that emit high levels of EMF, potentially do the lifestyle changes. That you need move those devices away. Again,
the reason we created the Havn was for people who want a seat belt, who want to keep using technology the way they’ve always had, and minimize their exposure.
The more,
you’re willing to compromise and do changes, the less you need a Havn, right? Like, the ideal solution out there is actually moving to the mountains and living in a log cabin. And not using any electronic devices, and you’re not gonna have any exposure. And then there is everything in between. And, the more of an urban, connected lifestyle you’re living,
the more you need to Havn
But, again, with using any EMF meter, you can definitely identify the sources of radiation that are around you
and make the necessary changes
to get less exposure. Yeah.
I don’t know if even in the woods how much we can get away from it. I think about all the satellites that are circling around and all the radio towers that are, you know, standing up so high, sending signals that I don’t know if that’s killing us too or not.
I would imagine they’re involved in it. And it’s probably hard to really get away from that almost anywhere. Yeah, but you’re still going to have a lot less exposure and than what you have in a city, especially with now the emergence of 5G towers, which are at every corner of every block, if you want to get the same coverage
you’ve got about ten times more 5G towers and you have 4G towers to get
the same coverage.
And, so, yeah, you’re in nature. You’re definitely going to have a lot less exposure than what you would get in any modern city today. Yeah, I recently switched carriers for my cell phone, and I remember the other one that was trying to keep me was saying, oh, well, if you have this particular setting, essentially we’ve contracted with everyone else that’s on the same service essentially, and you’ll actually jump wi fi to Wi-Fi as you’re traveling around the city.
I’m thinking, really, you have that many signals where I can always be connected pretty much by WiFi, just by driving around. Well, yeah,
the way this is going and, you know, I also consider the possibility that,
with SpaceX and all the satellites that are going up there, somehow that’s all going to be tied together.
Someday we’ll probably all be under that umbrella eventually when it comes to our technology. Arthur this has been a pretty interesting discussion. I learned a lot. Is there anything I should have asked but didn’t? Because I really don’t know enough to ask all the right questions? No. I mean, we didn’t get into, you know,
the cellular level reasons or, behaviors of EMF and as to why they impact
our cells.
But that might be a little to,
nerdy
for the audience. I think, this was a really interesting conversation. What I’ll add is, we’ve talked a lot about the downsides and the negative. And I just want to and maybe on a little bit of a happier note, which is that,
we, live in a world where we have access to so much more,
compared to the generations before.
And technology has really made our life so much more comfortable. And,
there is a flip side to this, technology, which is the exposure to EMF, but there is also a really positive side. And so, having that awareness around the effects of, cell phone radiation, of Wi-Fi, of Bluetooth, and of all the EMF that is around us can help us make the right decision to continue to benefit from all that technology.
While being aware, making the smart choice for ourselves and the smart choice can be different from for everyone, right? Like, not everyone has to be fully gobbled up in Haven. But at least be aware. Similarly to the fact that, you know, we’re aware that if you’re biking behind a bus that is like emitting dark fumes, this is probably not great for your lungs, and you can choose to keep biking behind it, or you can maybe take a breather.
And, similarly to knowing if your water is polluted
and you can choose to filter it or you can choose not to. So, that’s a perfect analogy there. Yeah. It’s the air you breathe, the water you drink, you want it filtered, right? Ideally. And but at least like having that awareness is really the first step towards making the smart choice for yourself.
We have a lot more education on our website, Havnwear.com H A V N W E A R .com on our science page, we have a white paper that
goes into a lot more detail about what are EMF,
what is the story behind science? What is the existing science and the effects and steps you can take?
So,
you can keep diving
into the science, but at a minimum of what you’ve learned today, should already put you on the right track to make a few changes that can make a big difference. And, ideally, you share this with your friends and family as well.
something else I saw on your website, too.
It was kind of like, you know, to continue the education, subscribe here. I would imagine you crank out some newsletters. We do. Yeah, absolutely.
it is a space
that more and more people are becoming aware of. But there are still a lot of, blurriness. There’s a lot of murkiness. And as we mentioned before, unfortunately, bad actors in the space that are trying to take advantage of the fact that people don’t necessarily understand the physics, behind EMF and God knows that not everyone’s is, is an engineer and can understand
the difference between,
a sticker
and an actual electromagnetic shield.
So, continue educating yourself,
and
share what you’ve learned
with your loved one. Yes, yes, yes. Well, Arthur, thank you so much. I feel like I know a lot more about this stuff. I want to head to the website Havnware HAVN no e n
just HAVNWEAR.com use the coupon code.
DrHaley, if you make a purchase. And thank you for tuning in to this podcast. Thank you Arthur. Thank you for having me, Michael.
that was really fun. And thanks everyone for tuning in I hope you learn a thing or two.
I hope you enjoyed that episode today on the Dr. Haley Show. Make sure to hit subscribe on whichever platform you are listening to this. If this episode made you think of someone, go ahead, take a screenshot and share this exact episode with them. You can catch the show notes for this episode on drhaley.com. If you want to geek out with Dr. Michael Haley on other radical health topics.
Be sure to check out his YouTube channel where he posts exclusive video content. All the details are at drhaley.com and we can’t wait to hang out with you on the next episode.
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